On Thursday night, Fox News host Tucker Carlson took on Jasmine Rand, a former lawyer for the families of Trayvon Martin and Michael Brown, over her support of a deeply racist post from a Black Lives Matter leader in Kentucky.
Rand was defending a post in Leo Weekly penned by Chanelle Helm, the co-founder of Black Lives Matter-Louisville, in which Helm laid out a list of 10 demands white people should adhere to in order to rid themselves of their inherent sin of whiteness, apparently.
Rand didn't claim to support "every bullet point of the list that she's drafted," but said she does support the "underlying messages and principles" of Helm's letter.
"Carlson, you and I both grew up with white privilege, which means we didn't have to think about race first while growing up," said Rand. “That’s not true for many African-Americans and many Latino people, and I think that we need to acknowledge that important and distinctive difference.”
The Tucker Carlson Tonight host jumped in to call out Rand's generalizations.
"What you're doing is making a generalization based on race, which is the textbook definition of racism. You're assuming that a person's race is the most important thing about him. There are plenty of white people in this country who grew up with no privilege at all, and there are a lot of black people ... who are very privileged. A person's race is not always the most important thing about that person," he said.
Rand then accused Carlson of "putting words in my mouth."
"What I wanted to say before I was cut off is that I think the issue in our nation is more an intersection of race, of poverty, of national origin. There are multiple factors that are coexisting simultaneously that, as a nation, we can no longer pick apart and say, make generalizations based on black and white because poverty is such a big issue in our nation," said the attorney.
"[Helm] is making an extremely important point," continued Rand. "What she's calling upon white Americans to do, is to call out racists."
"First of all, she's addressing this to 'white people,'" retorted Carlson, "which by its nature is divisive, and I would argue, racist, as if all white people have something in common that's meaningful; they don't, at all. I mean, a recent arrival from New Zealand has nothing in common with my kids. ... She's assuming that the person's color is the most important thing."
"Why would you defend this? I don't understand," he added.
Rand said she wasn't defending the actual bullet points of the letter, but "what we need to talk about are the underlying principles."
"What she's saying is that power never concedes itself," she stated. When white people see racism in the work place or elsewhere, they need to "call it out."
"Why not just say 'people'? Why are you, and why is she, using people's race as a category?" he asked. "Why are you referring to people by their race? I don't understand."
"Because, again, you wouldn't understand because you lived with white privilege your entire life. You don't understand what it is to be in the position of an Africa-American woman who has faced discrimination," replied Rand.
Carlson had enough.
"Now you're getting so dumb — look, I’m trying to take you seriously, but I can’t.”